Born: June 9, 1972
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July 09, 2003 at 2:12 pm
My life as a superposited array...
There’s a list on the kitchen counter. It’s an 8 1/2“x11” piece of paper, filled with scribbles of things that I’m supposed to accomplish this week. Most of the items have been scratched off by now, but there are still a few things left to do. I used to keep all the things that I had to do painstakingly organized on my Palm Pilot, but after a couple of years of being obsessed by this, I found that it just wasn’t “organic” enough for my random thought-processes. So much to do, so little…
And I haven’t been completely honest with you: the last couple of days haven’t been completely blogless. Aside from the couple of posts that I’ve managed to get online, I have also been reading a lot and posting my fair share of comments on others’ Blogs. How am I fitting all of this stuff in? (In the amount of time I have in the day and the amount of space I have in my brain?)
One Blog post of mention is from Real Live Preacher (yes, I’ve mentioned him before). The post is about forgiveness and why we, as believers, should give it freely, not just for forgiveness’s sake, but also give it because it is a gift to ourselves. This sparked a thread of comments (for and against this idea) that was very provocative and interesting.
A question that arose, though, had me racking my brain all day yesterday:
...If our duty is to forgive our enemies, so that we may be sons and daughters of our Father in heaven (much less so that our own sins may be forgiven)...After talking to my friend Troy this morning, after Matins, I had this to say:
then what about forgiving Satan?
~ Jason Pratt
I must say that the comment-discussion that was started about Satan kind of wrecked me yesterday. I just couldn’t get a grasp on the whole “forgive Satan” aspect. It seemed like we should — I mean, it seemed Biblical. This also tied into forgiveness being a gift and who, in fact, the gift was for.My brother had this to add:
I was discussing the subject with a friend this morning, though, and he had some great insight (which I don’t think has been hit upon yet). I’m most likely going to be adding my own interpretation to his insight…
It is that, while forgiveness and grace are a free gift from God, they are only given if asked for — and when given, they are given in the form of “redemption.”
Now, from a human standpoint, forgiveness can (and should) be given freely without it being asked for. Forgiveness releases both the “forgiver” and the “forgave” from bonds (bitterness, hate, disrespect, etc.) that the “forgiver” had created. But, just because the “forgiver” has forgiven the “forgave,” it doesn’t mean that the “forgave” is redeemed (as per God’s version of forgiveness). While forgiving someone is a “gift” to the “forgave,” it might only be a gift that allows the person to know (if you tell him) that he can come to you and ask for redemption — and, more importantly, ask for forgiveness from God.
In this case, yes, it is Biblically correct for us to forgive Satan, but that doesn’t mean that Jesus’s death automatically forgave Satan. For this to happen, as it did with us, Satan must ask the Lord for forgiveness. If he ever did this, then God would surely forgive him.
Therefore, we can forgive Satan, releasing any sort of “grudge” (bond) that we had with him (if we ever had one at all). By doing this, we are imparting a gift to ourselves — freeing ourselves from the strongholds that we created.
Satan’s job, is then to ask forgiveness from God so that he may receive true (free) redemption. This cannot happen unless he asks. This cannot happen unless we ask.
...the power to forgive lies in the one offended and in the one seeking forgiveness. God is the one offended so we don’t have power over the issue. Moreover, Satan does not want forgiveness, so the question is futile.What a tricky subject… Time is also my enemy. So, how am I supposed to forgive time?
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Comments (7)
But where is the plan of redemption for satan? Christ died for the sins of man. Nowhere are we told that he died for the angels. What faith is required for an angel to believe in what he sees? Surely the angels are held to a higher standard due to their relationship with God. Hence, when some fell, there was no chance for redemption and they were banished. I am afraid it is a stretch to suppose that Christ’s sacrifice might apply to Satan when we are nowhere told that it would. Interesting discussion though 
» Comment by Ray () (URL), on July 10, 2003 at 5:49 pm
Yes, you are correct that there is not a plan of redemption for Satan… As I said, he would only be able to be redeemed if he asked for forgiveness — which he never will.
I differ in my opinion in one fact, though: Christ died for man… With a lack of collegiate theologial training, my opinion is that Christ died for sinners. There is a big semantical difference here, as sinners referes to much more than just humans.
Still, while Christ’s blood cleansed all sinners, sinners must still ask for forgiveness to receive the gift of redemption from God.
My conclusion (what my brother said) still holds true for me, though, that we (humans) are not the offended ones who need to forgive Satan at all. Satan offended God, so God is the one who must forgive Satan.
I differ in my opinion in one fact, though: Christ died for man… With a lack of collegiate theologial training, my opinion is that Christ died for sinners. There is a big semantical difference here, as sinners referes to much more than just humans.
Still, while Christ’s blood cleansed all sinners, sinners must still ask for forgiveness to receive the gift of redemption from God.
My conclusion (what my brother said) still holds true for me, though, that we (humans) are not the offended ones who need to forgive Satan at all. Satan offended God, so God is the one who must forgive Satan.
» Comment by timsamoff () (URL), on July 10, 2003 at 6:24 pm
He does a pretty darn good job of offending me.
» Comment by Ray () (URL), on July 10, 2003 at 6:32 pm
My heart rejoices in God even more when I think that he provided a fallen sinner like me a plan of salvation that he did not provide for fallen angels. It also points to how precious human beings are to God.
» Comment by John () , on May 01, 2004 at 10:32 pm
Hi! I’m the fellow who wrote the question in RLP years ago. (Was poking around on the net today, and found this remark.)
I don’t remember what I eventually followed that up with (if anything) on RLP’s site, but I thought you’d be interested to know that I believe Troy’s answer is the correct one (your brother’s comment was also good, though.)
Actually, we are told in Col 1:19ff that it was the Father’s good pleasure to reconcile all things to Himself making peach through the blood of the cross, and Paul then makes a point of specifically emphasizing that this includes things “in the heavens” as well as on earth.
So yes, salvation is offered for rebellious ‘things in the heavens’, too, if they’ll accept it.
I don’t remember what I eventually followed that up with (if anything) on RLP’s site, but I thought you’d be interested to know that I believe Troy’s answer is the correct one (your brother’s comment was also good, though.)
Actually, we are told in Col 1:19ff that it was the Father’s good pleasure to reconcile all things to Himself making peach through the blood of the cross, and Paul then makes a point of specifically emphasizing that this includes things “in the heavens” as well as on earth.
So yes, salvation is offered for rebellious ‘things in the heavens’, too, if they’ll accept it.
» Comment by Jason Pratt () , on October 20, 2006 at 11:21 am
Wow. Thanks for coming back around after all of this time, Jason. Your comments are good ones!
» Comment by timsamoff () (URL), on October 20, 2006 at 1:57 pm
Well, except for a few odd mis-spells on my part… (hey—God is making schnapps from the blood of the cross! {rotfl!})
Also, I realized afterward the long comments had been from you to Troy. Sorry, my bad. {s!}
Also, I realized afterward the long comments had been from you to Troy. Sorry, my bad. {s!}
» Comment by Jason Pratt () , on October 24, 2006 at 11:13 am